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tv   Quadriga - Trumps First Year Beyond All Reason  Deutsche Welle  January 12, 2018 5:30am-6:01am CET

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stories in. it's all about george chance to discover the world from different perspectives. join us in an inspired by distinctive instagram or use. d.w. story to talk to each week on instagram. alone a very warm welcome indeed to quadriga coming to you from the heart of berlin and this week the focus is on u.s. president donald trump he was of course sworn into office last january and will shortly complete one here in the white house after what has been a truly helter-skelter first twelve months featuring nonstop running battles with his critics his enemies and even his allies now a new book fire and fury by journalist michael wolff portrays a president and
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a white house that have both it seems out of kilter so our question this week on quadriga is trump's first year beyond all reason question mark and this stance that question i'm joined here in the studio by three excellent observers and analysts beginning with matthew carney the chief europe correspondent at politico and matthew argues that it might be tempting to dismiss donald trump as a clown without a coherent agenda but that he says would be a mistake also with us as christiane i'm i am very familiar face from german t.v. a r d network she believes crazy or not trump is divisive and destructive but worse still are the people who are letting him get away with it she says she smiles to found a warm welcome to our bright opinion editor with balanced target should be a good newspaper and a contributing writer for the new york times says u.s. foreign policy under trumping. not beyond reason but it's probably not really
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trumps only foreign policy. interesting you know i look forward to talking about that but first of all on a let's talk about this book fire and fury from michael wolff about goings on in the white house about the president you as somebody who is sort of a keen student of u.s. politics i'm eager to hear what you have to say about this book well it's entertaining and a terrible way as the whole trump presidency and i think that's what struck me most is that you read it and you want to go on reading it because it's like a really entertaining piece of journalism and then you have to tell yourself well this may not be the full reality but it's sort of an important part of it so we shouldn't laugh and that's what we have to remind ourselves all the time when talking about trump is that we should not laugh about him too much this is serious christiane i'm are you to are you have an eagle eye american politics you were a correspondent in washington for for almost a d.s.s.
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almost eight years what do you make of the book you know i thank you for is it journalism it's probably both i think it confirms our worst fears i mean. the actual situation in the white house is probably as described in the book maybe it's an accurate in some parts but it is as my colleague said entertaining but in a bad ways like an accident you can't look away if you keep reading and it's. really amazing how adaptable human beings are we thought when from took office that this is totally impossible and we're shocked and disgusted and whatever else and now we think it's an entertaining very sad and you know more destructive situation not normal i would go that far i would however go yeah. matthew carney nic what do you make of the door i mean what was that what for you when you read the book as much as you have read what is the most worrying revelation from the book.
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you know i would say that there's any one thing that's particularly worrying i think that reading the book is a almost a guilty pleasure number one because i think for many of us it confirms as christiane said our worst fears of though i don't think that they really needed to be confirmed because they're confirmed every day on twitter and elsewhere so i think it's further confirmation really of what we already knew that said i think that there are serious questions about the veracity of much of what is in the book and some people say well even if only twenty percent of what michael wolff is written here is true that's still horrendous which is certainly true but when you do not you don't want to say horrendous i've got you know one thing one line that leapt out at me trump won't read anything not a one page memo not a brief not the brief policy papers nothing. at all that's probably not true i think that that he will read one page memo you know he this is
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a person though who went around boasting that he got through college without opening a textbook so you know and it's also worth remembering that the people who are his base they're not going to be reading this book number one and their only real sort of perception of the book will probably be on fox news where the book is being you know shredded day in and day out and you know michael wolff sort of castigated as this charlatan so i don't think that in terms of his base it's going to hurt him very much the people who read the book they've sold a million copies already apparently are the people who already hate trump and they're going to hate him even more oil if that's not it's not going to be a game changer and it's not going to be a significant blow to the president's standing no. no because i think that they've already been fairly successful in discrediting the book because there are factual errors in it and this is sort of a classic tactic he gets a lot of small things wrong he has written the book in a style that is i think for a journalist somewhat dangerous because he's trying to recreate conversations and.
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it's written you know almost like a thriller in that or it or a novel and these are conversations that he didn't witness firsthand so that's always always problematic and there are a number of cases that have been pointed out where there are actual factual errors and that undermines the book and that's why i say it's it is you know it's fun to read but i think you have to take everything you know with a grain of my rights in saying that it has nevertheless got under the president's skin and. i would say yes and i don't agree it will probably not end the presidency but i disagree in one point i think some of the some of the people of his base will read it because we have seen a little change there i mean there are people now in the social networks you can follow who say well i voted for him but that is not exactly what i wanted in the end so i think it will add to the what is the discredit taishan of the president and way but it will not end his presidency so it will have an influence on that case and on the one final comment i mean i'm interested because we haven't
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mentioned yet i mean the remarkable thing that we have the u.s. president coming out and not not saying ok that book is out there i'm ignoring it because it's not true it's fake it's lies from his perspective becoming you know it's an actually defending his own mental health strange times we live in this i mean that was a very strange moment maybe one of the strangest moments in this presidency full of strange moments and it shows how we do have personality in the oval office and. that is very very sad but that makes the book even more problematic because in being that entertaining in showing how his marriage works and at great new york times story about how he spends his day drinking coke zero and watching the television these are all facts that blur the full picture that he's actually a pretty effective president. let's talk about the pretty effective president
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matthew certainly it is a true unverifiable the fact that he's going to have been he's going to be marking one year in office very shortly we know that much what's your verdict do you agree with a lot it is that he's a very effective president yes definitely and i think part of the strategy is to put this picture of complete chaos out there he's sort of. presented the presidency as this kind of reality show we're now seeing in response to the book actually to show that he is a serious person that he can read and so forth we're seeing the cabinet meetings being televised in part in this type of thing but you know this is one aspect of what's going on this is sort of the public picture and then behind the scenes his people are systematically undoing decades of regulation in the united states number one if you look at what's happened at the environmental protection agency for example it's basically being dismantled they've allowed for example drilling on both the atlantic and the pacific coast so we're talking about
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millions of hectors of c. that will be open potentially to drilling in the coming years it's things like this that i think really will have an impact in in the long term and the other big area is is the courts where he inherited more vacancies more judicial vacancies than any other president i believe in the history of the country in the significance of this is that he will get to nominate now more than one hundred i think it's one hundred fifty federal judges potentially in the coming years and these are people who serve out life terms which means that long after trump has left office you will have judges there sitting on the federal bench making really important decisions and this also includes the supreme court he's already nominated and had approved one justice and more likely to follow given the sort of age dynamic on the supreme court so i think that he already has been very effective in this regard it hasn't
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gotten as much attention because of the tweets because of this whole sideshow doing something that you have the same problem this is a loss it's a smokescreen a war. i mean i would just say one more word on that i do think that he's very vain and i think this is the problem and you know he has to respond to everything but i think that there are people in the background that we don't hear so much from that are really pushing i don't know if it's his agenda but they're pushing a very conservative republican agenda behind the scenes and it's having him and a very coherent and a to it. and take the whole tax suggestion that i wasn't going to mention or at the tax reform too because i mean that's something that's going to have a very long to yes it's going to have a very long term effect and it's going to if it if it stays in place it's going to affect the middle class in ways that. make those problems worse than the socio economic problems that have brought into office so i think there are long term effects that we kind of ignore when we talk about coherence incoherence is not such
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a thing trump ism that might be but the inquiry and conferences also that for example the republicans never wanted a huge deficit now trump comes along with this tax reform and the deficit is going to believe and out of control tricky deficit spending so it's totally inconsistent and at the same time the republican agenda is going to be pushed through as you said on practically every level no matter what and i think to say something critical watch ourselves the press i mean all this just trying to does this. tweeting and sort of saying crazy stuff you know all that has really distracted us completely from what is happening on the radar and all these things like for example the national parks you know he's going to really hurt a country by doing these things and people have not really realize what is happening because everybody is going on about how crazy is all the time and that
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makes him a lot less crazy than people think. and none of you have mentioned so far at least i think it's true to say that the what the washington post says is trump's strongest selling point the economy. well the economy is doing well it was doing well before and of course trump will take credit for everything he takes credit for you know every time the dow jones breaks a new record he sends out you know tweet advertising that. the economy is doing well and i think it will have to continue to do well for him to be reelected because people run out of reasons to vote for him and i think that in a couple years time when he faces reelection he's going to really need to show number one a strong economy and a lot of progress on these other things that that he promised including the wall in a lot of the symbolic things and he has made progress there too though i mean it we haven't talked about through salome and and certain other promises that he made and
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these are again the things that matter to his base even for people who don't like him and i think depending on what the choice is a lot of people will hold their nose and say i really don't like him i don't think he's a good person even but he's better than the alternative and he's doing a lot of what i want and this is especially true for the christian base the conservative christian base for whom these judges because of the decisions they make on issues like abortion and a lot of other social matters gay marriage and so forth that's extremely important to them ok we talked about donald trump the man we found some first impressions on his record we haven't talked enough about foreign policy matthews become to mention it let's get some impressions first of all of what's been going on in the foreign policy field and then we'll continue the conversation. trumps foreign policy is driven by un compromising egotism america and trump first as his motto he wants to build a two thousand mile long wall along the border with mexico and withdraw from international trade agreements. his plans to totally and completely stop muslims from entering
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the us have also caused outrage the complete immigration ban has been prevented in the courts. trump started a war of words with north korean dictator kim jong un and he even seems to consider nuclear war to be a viable strategic option. and with his unilateral decision to recognize jerusalem as the capital of israel trump broke with diplomatic conventions stirring up anger in the arab world and beyond. both his allies and opponents are baffled by his foreign policy decisions how dangerous is this president. ok christiane ameritech up our question how dangerous are installed trump a dangerous president who needs to be on the lookout i don't have an answer to that because. i mean he's definitely an erratic person and we don't really know if he has a plan and what that plan could possibly be i mean even his secretary of state is
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more or less unknown person when it comes to that and we know that she dismantled a lot of his old stuff that we don't even have an ambassador in germany of one year after trump took office i mean it's weird and it's inconsistent and nobody knows what comes next at least i don't. see a foreign policy bully. well clearly i think we have seen that in the kind of threats that he's made towards north korea towards mexico china you name it i mean this is just his his style and some people would argue well it has been affected in certain instances where he would himself well you know north korea because there's been something of a full in the last week or so the last several days in relations between north and south korea trump says it's because i threw my wife's around because i was uncompromising well this i believed there might be something to that if that's really in the interest of the united states is another is another question because it appears that north korea is really trying to kind of create a
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a wedge between seoul and washington here by cozying up to the south koreans well we'll see we'll see if that works but you know at the end of the day it's been very disruptive and this is something that he wanted to achieve these type of disruptions been very disruptive in particular i would argue to the transatlantic relationship with his criticism of nato and even though he hasn't really followed through on many of the threats that he's made it has caused many people in europe to question the united states commitment to europe to the nato alliance and it's very problematic i would say for people in europe especially in western europe who support the transatlantic relationship and wanted to continue because you have a lot of which is most people in churches maybe most people but you have mainstream people also in germany and in the s.p.d. in the social democratic party for example saying you know we really need to
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rethink this whole relationship and look at our options and put wind in the sails i would say to people who might have been a little bit skeptical of the relationship with america to begin with out of this is one of your special fields. i'd like to say. as much as i agree that he's erratic in the foreign policy area too we do see continuity is and we do see a lot of course here and the ideology behind it is very coherent and it has been put out and their early in the presidency by herman mcmaster and gary cohen an op ed for the washington post saying that. if. training the world as an arena of competing actors and they have been going on with that they have been looking at the world like that ever since and it also shows in the national security strategy that was just released in the last year and this is how he looks at europe too and this is why we also see some continuity. for
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example when when it comes to eastern europe he's been very supportive. towards eastern europe against russia and he has let some of the policies we've seen with the previous administrations in place reinforcing troops and troops to to poland the whole energy policy were european or us economic interests in selling. gas come together with edgy. political interests and this is all very coherent and like a bloc. we don't like it germany doesn't like it it doesn't like that sort of hyper realistic policies based on national interests but that's what it is and is it his policy yes or is it the policy of coherence off the generals who are actually there interested as to the point i was making. is that as long as they get him to to hold. in line with this policy and they get him to do
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that most of the time i think we can still say that it's pretty clear here and i think we're looking at. yeah but i think they i mean you know that they they say they have to babysit him basically and make sure that he doesn't and he do anything really supposed to but so i wonder is it a trump coherency or is it actually of the sort of the knowledge of people who have been around for a long time in foreign policy and who know how the game is played and you know they they might more or less listen to him a little bit and what he wants but at the same time they have pretty much do what has always been done with maybe a little shift to it's in europe yes but all in all i would say if it was his policy it would be core haven't at all i think it's just they just keep it from from totally ballooning out of control and what about germany the what about germany's transatlantic policy i mean need to do american saying the times when we can fully rely on others are in some measure overs purely referring to the u.s.
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sigma gabriele the foreign minister relations between the u.s. and europe won't be the same anymore even when donald trump leaves the white house that signals a watershed moment in transatlantic relations it might actually i think relations will be better once he's gone and he will be gone eventually at the same time i think that it also has to do with the european feeling of trying to become strong europe and to to to be more independent off being an influence of the americans and the united states so i think it's a double strategy also if you can see that obviously we are not them the main part us anymore but at the same time it gives us the chance to sort of look around and say who are we you know who do we want to be where do we go and what is our aim do we want to be europeans do the germans and the special relationship do you want to be just part of a big scheme of western values whatever you know so it's a redefinition of the own situation and the european situation at the start it's
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going to europe we need to talk a little bit about what if anything trump a suppose we have cold it has to do with the increasingly influential populist parties here in europe certainly many populist leaders and voters around europe see donald trump as an inspiration. britain's departure from the european union indicates a historic turning point one reason so many in britain voted to leave the e.u. was a fear of further immigration. in austria a right wing nationalist government has formed as in both hungary and poland all three share a mistrust of what they call brussels bureaucracy a fear of islam and a desire for isolationism. right wing populists are now driving the political agendas in many european countries in germany two politicians are talking publicly about a conservative revolution with an emphasis on homeland family and christian values
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is donald trump the leading figure of this new shift towards the right in america first. you know matthew what is the overlap between donald trump and trump ism and far right populism in europe. i think the overlap is that many of the same forces that drove trump into office are also present in europe and have been present for some time this backlash against globalization for example there's worry about migration the refugee crisis and so forth i would still be careful though in assuming that trump has had an effect on on european politics drek least in the immediate aftermath in fact of his election we had several elections in europe where the populace didn't win or didn't perform as well as many had feared in austria in the netherlands and in france of course where michael won against the four nasional so you know i don't think that there's a direct correlation there that said this is
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a phenomenon throughout the western world if you will does this populism and it's not going to end anytime soon it's very very gallant at the moment in europe in poland in hungary and austria as we've recently seen and although you know the populace didn't win many of these elections they overall have done pretty well in europe over over the past year so i think that this is something that the europeans are also going to have to continue to deal with and obviously last word on this germany with with the alternative for germany now in the parliament is another reminder that this is a problem that remains and what is the alternative for germany go to do with with with trumpets and. i absolutely agree with matthew i think it's parallel developments that we see with with the same that that came out for the same reason but there is no or very little direct. influence or couple of interviews so
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the one thing you've written about because we're running out of time a little bit to you've written about the zeitgeist we're so we're marking fifty years of one thousand nine hundred sixty eight the time of the of freedom and democracy student protests and what have you but there are a lot of people in europe their own people. united states are saying it was decadent it was problematic it was it was dangerous because it led to the leftwing terrorism that site geist what's the what's the connection between the us and germany they're on both kind of your frustration with what liberalism or pasta modern liberalism led to and people feel like structures that the values are breaking down and there is nothing to replace them and they are looking for a new ideologies that give them are in taishan and their lives and i think this is part of where these populist movements find the force to grow. their own. stuff so if we're going to talk again you know but let me say i mean in germany it's ten maybe fourteen percent so the people who are really frustrated people
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really frustrated that doesn't mean it's a complete change of game and i think also as an effect people have tried to reassure their own values but is a positive thing to happen you know and so i think looking at it in a more positive way that's a good thing the bad thing or the influence of trump the washington post what. have light one thousand nine hundred fifty times so far and nobody has many countries are very few people have contradicted in the new york times especially if that is the new you know that never have a problem ok thank you very much all three of you fascinating stuff we're going to have to leave it there that we've been talking about trump's first year beyond all reason was the question you make up your mind to food for thought if you've enjoyed the show as much as i have come back next weekend.
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zero news come to luxembourg and let's go right to our correspondent who is in central istanbul i'm joined by the clergy abuse political correspondent all those stories in just a minute but first this news just cool but perspective closer. i should makea has no children which makes her feel worthless and incomplete. in a society that expects them to bear children this is a burden many childless women in niger suffer from. a wife is only fully accepted upon motherhood. a very personal film about the suffering of childless women who cannot ensure a. fruitless treat starting january fourteenth on t w.
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look if. you know i think the evidence very clear and for the everyday person the question is what can they do about it so fail to simply walk with me and don't take lives or elevators i do i do that every time i think about elevator or lift and there's a still waiting about i take the stairs. and i try and walk wherever i can instead of going in a car or even in public transport it's just you know doing things that i think would be very common that we just got out of the habit as a big concrete museum click to tell court of appeals that actually it's not very hard to change the springs encourage individuals to i think you know keep you musically making a difference. i
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am curious. this is d.w. news live from berlin after waiting more than a hundred days is germany finally about to get a new government political leaders have been burning the midnight oil as they approach the deadline for doing a deal on forming a new coalition government will they succeed we'll have the latest also coming out . thousands rally in pakistan to protest against the rape and murder of an eight year old girl demanding to know why police were so slow to react to the.